Quite a few members of GenealogyWise lists including Kirsty and me have joined the "Genealogists for Families" project started up by Judy Webster from Queensland, Australia.
Genealogists worldwide, and their friends and relatives, are working as a team to help small family businesses in low income areas.
Our motto is, 'We care about families (past, present and future)'. Already the Genealogists for Families project has 63 members helping 91 individuals or groups. It would be great if you'd join our team at http://ning.it/say644
Hi, I'm new to this but have been searching my Ancestry for 2 years now. I discovered I have ancestors who immigrated from Scotland and settled in the New England states. Based on my research, this is somewhat uncommon. I believe they most likely immigrated in the 1700's and my 4th Great Grandfather was born in Vermont in the late 1700's. Does anyone have any information on the Montgomery Clan? Supposedly my ancestor who immigrated was the leader of a company of men who left Scotland ater one of the numerous wars with England and settled in the New England State. My 4th Great Grandfather was John Montgomery (b. ABT 1793, Vermont) and his son was Charles Fowler Montgomery (b. 1814, Otego, NY). If anyone has come across this family, any information would be greatly appreciated!
Hi! Contrary to all the Irish connections people claim for Neely, my Neely ancestor Thomas Neely is reportedly from Scotland per the 1880.census recording his son, John's, family. John Neely (b. about 1819 or 1820 in Cincinnati, OH) came to Mobile, Alabama and by 1850 was married to Francis Hernandez and had 2nd children. My difficulty is they were low on the socioeconomic ladder as they were butchers and as a result there are few records. I'm trying tohop thr pond but am not sure how to do it properly.
Yes, I can't figure out how to get to that conversation that you just sent me. You have intermediate researcher, so I am sure that you have looked for different spellings of Neely. That is whay happens, even in the same family, or depending on the person that is doing the Census, or even, we found people writing names down on passenger lists, depending on how is it pronounced. Lots of different reasons. But, it is unfortunate your experience with the picture. Have you tried finding that person that has the picture. I love pictures, but that was unfair of that person, especially if they knew who they were. But, on the other hand, you meet lots of lovely people that are willing to share. If there is anything that I can do to help, please let me know. I love helping find the pieces to the puzzle.
Thank you Judy. I appreciate your assistance. I own the picture. My mother gave it 2yo me but no one can identify it with certainty. I have been working in this about 10 years off and on always looking for new sources.
In The Journal of Sir William Brereton of Handforth, Cheshire, wirtten in 1635, it states:
Wee lodged in Glasgoaw in Mr. David Weymes house : his wifes name is Margrett Cambell (the wives in Scottland never change butt allwayes retaine their owne names) noe stabling hereunto belonging
I have not seen this reference to married women's names before. How true is this?
Yes it is true! And they carried the convention all over the English speaking world. Here in Cape Town I se this every time I go off to the Cemetaries to Photographicaly record the headstones for a South African Website. Very practical people my Mothers side. Make excellent Lawyers and Engeneers!
I have read also that when naming children, the oldest son is usually named for the paternal grandfather and the second son is actually the junior. While this is not always the case, if a family is actually doing this, it can give good clues as to where to go for more information.
While doing my research I came across this quite a bit, William. For example, all references to Sir Charles Douglas' mother (that I can remember) call her Christian Hepburn rather than Christian Douglas. Some sources I read said that this was the norm in Scotland (at least in the Lowlands) up until about the 17th Century, and that it was done on headstones and in legal documents after that. However, I read one article from 1867 that said that women in Scotland do not retain their maiden names, so the change happened somewhere in between.
Yes, and the first female child was usually named after the maternal grandmother. So, when doing research, if there is a child missing, sometimes, it is easy to figure out who is who. But, on the other hand, I have not seen Jr. used. A lot of times, which makes it more confusing, is the child used their middle name to go by. Or a "nickname". Margaret, in my family was "Polly".
The one thing, though, at least in my family, all of the children use that naming pattern. So, imagine, if you go to a family gathering, someone calls out James, and 10 people answer "Yes". Another sad thing, that I have seen many times, in the "older" days, if a child was born illegitimate, that "title" was carried through on their marriage cert. and even on their death cert. Scottish birth, marriage and death cert. are wonderful for records. If a child is born, usually, if the parents are married, it states their marriage date, and also many records have not just the individuals but their parents and their parents occupations and witnesses. So helpful when researching and also many have witnesses, which a lot of times, are siblings or close relatives. I wish the English documents were so detailed.
This is true,even to today, a lot of the times, in Quebec, Canada, also.
Yes, that is the list that I have been using for years. Good that you posted it. I was just looking for it myself to post. You are right, it does occur in many still, and very helpful looking for siblings, etc.
I understand what you mean. There are so many Thomases and Johns in my family tree that it is hard to distinguish who belongs to whom. Recently, I think that I found one of my great great grandfather's sisters but instead of going by the name I had seen on the census which was Mary Jane, She was using the name Mollie. Her death certificate said Mollie Neely Daffron. She was in 1910 widowed, running a boarding house and keeping her nephew's children in New Orleans. Do you know if Mollie is a nickname for anything?
My Gr. Aunt was MARY ANN, and her nickname was POLLY. If you check this site out, and on another page is men's Nicknames, you will see a huge variance. It is very helpful. I think they used nicknames a lot, because of the naming pattern and so many in the family with the same name. I wish they had been more inventive. It is great, when I see the name Barbara, once in a while, so much more helpful, than 10 James, 10 Williams, 10 Margarets etc. etc.
Yes, MOLLIE is one of the nicknames, used for Margaret.
More than likely, Jr. was named after his grandfather, like his father before him. My grandmother, which I found interesting, named her children after her sisters, but they in turn had been named by the "Naming Patter" firstly. Interesting and very helpful, though.
I never thought of Mollie being a nickname for Mary.
I also have to consider any Latin naming patterns as John Neelys wife was an Hernandez. And from what I can discern due to the fact that the children of John Neely (Scottish/Irish ancestry) and Frances Hernandez (Latin ancestry , 1880 census says Italy but I think maybe Canary Islands) marry into the creole population in Mobile, Alabama where they are often documented as mulatto. They may have identified more with this side of the family. At least one child moved to St. Bernard Parish where there is a large Canary Island population.
What would have been the educational concerns of a 1st generation American of Scotch-Irish descent of low socioeconomic status for his daughters in the mid to late 1800s? Do you know?
Most of my 18th & 19th century families follow the Scottish naming pattern. 1st son named for father's father. 2nd son for mother's father and 3rd son for father and 1st daughter for mother's mother, 2nd for father's mother and 3rd for mother. After that sibblings of either parent. This can be very useful for determining which family a person belongs to. Not sure if a woman was actually known by her maiden name or just referred to when spoken about, but headstones always seem to be written that way. Jean Brown, wife of James Stevenson also Elisabeth Stevenson daughter of the above, wife of Robert Orr etc. Most helpful.
Depending on the age, and thinking sideways and squinting, I'm going with construction training carpenter. Not sure if they existed in 1881 but maybe it will start people thinking.
On the LDS 1881 disc James Moar 23 if transcribed as Formerly Cond Trung Car and his handicap is imbecile and on Ancestry it is transcribed as Formerly Cond Tram car.. Is it possible that he moved away for work, had a breakdown, hence former occupation, then came home to Mum. I see he was born on Yell which appears bigger than Unst, maybe it had a tramway. Sorry if this appeared before - wasn't sure if I clicked add comment.
There are no trams in Shetland - whether Yell or Unst. Also, the tail at the end of that word suggests it would end with a 'g' or a 'y'. I favour Training or Trimming. The word that really has me stumped, and also I suspect is also the key to the puzzle, is the "Cond" word.
my in-laws were from Glasgow. Robert Rodger-Minnie kirwood Murphy . Have ther birth cert. & marraige cert. Robt. was born 1903 & Minnie 1901.Robt. had 1 brother william imigrated to australia. Have no info on him. also robt,s mother Sarah Sinclair died young & an Aunt Lizzie Duncan took care of family.cannot find correct Murphy info. [Mother,s name was also minnie & father was william it is believed Minnie had 7 brother,s . hughie-john-wm. george-& do not know the other name,s any info would be helpful
de Ries, Steward Dapifer Eudo FitzHubert (1047-1080) * de Ries (de Ryes), Steward Hubert `Humbert` (1020-1086) * Steward, High Steward Walter of Dundonald (1198-1246) * Stewart, Alexander 4th (b.1243) * STEWART, EGIDIA (1327-1406) * Stewart, High Steward Alexander of Dundonald (1214-1283) * Stewart, High Steward James (1260-1309) * Stewart, High Steward Walter (1296...-1327) * Stewart, Janet (1510-1560) * Stewart, King James I * Stewart, King James IV (1473-1513) * Stewart, Lady Elizabeth * Stewart, Lady Mary (d.1434) * Stewart, Mary (1305-1360) * Stewart, Ms. (b.1412) * Stewart, Sir James (b.1298) * Stewart, Sir James 5th (1243-1309) * Stewart Dundonald, Walter (1180-1246) * Stewart of Atholl, Earl John (b.1475) * Stewart of Dundonald, Walter 3rd (1198-1246) * Stewart, of Scotland, High Steward Walter (1292-1327) * Stewart, of Scotland, king james II (b.1430) * Stewart, of Scotland, King James III (d.1488) * Stewart, of Scotland, Lady Egidia Gille (1332-1406) # Stuart, King Robert II (1315-1390) # Stuart, Princess Mary (1380-1458) # Stuart, `King` Robert III # Stuart of Lennox, Earl John Keeper of Dumbarton Castle (b.1430) # Stuart of Lennox, Lady Elizabeth # Stuart of Lennox, Lord Earl John Keeper of Dumbarton Castle (b.1430)
de Warenne/de Varenne, Countess Ada Adeline [mother of 2 Scottish kings]
Gilla Críst of Angus, Mormaer of Angus, son of Gille Brigte of Angus
Crist, Bethóc Beatrix
Marjorie "Princess" of Scotland Born: 1296 at: 23-1,515,866 Died: 2 MAR 1315/1316 at: Paisley,Renfrewshire,Scotland Father:*Robert the Bruce "King" of Scots Mother:*Isabel Mathilda "Lady" of , Mar
It is still in common useage that people refer to women by their maiden names & far from being confined to the Lowlands lots of my Highland ancestors were enumerated in the Censuses by their maiden names(particularly after being widowed). I would say after WW1 until maybe the past twenty years or so that women changed their names but when referred to would be called "Jane Doe" wife of "John Smith" especially if you stayed in the same area you were born /raised in.
Carolyn, these are my ancestors according to hand~charting using Tribal Pages / The information came from wherever I could find it online. I tend to be thorough. I do have some brick wall ancestors, still. There are more royal Scottish lines in my tree, but I thought I was overwhelming this board, so I added them to my Stories section on my Tribal Tree. Most of my royal lines are older than the Scottish ones. My grand~father sure was proud to be Scottish & spent time in Scotland. I will post pictures. Duh; I don't know how. I can put them on my wall.
The latest date you mention Barbara is Jean Mary Mackenzie 1628 - 1674 and prior to that the there is one at 1526, then 1256. What about the generations in between and how can you prove that these are all your ancestors. What documentation do you have and what is your link between 2014 and 1628? Are you asking for help in proving this? Any unsourced information has to be questionable.
Sue Wemett You wrote "I, in fact, can't find any information on any other McConnell is Scotland" I get 43,700 results for 'McConnells in Kirkcudbrightshire' in my Google search!!!!
Thanks, Rosemary, for the heads up on that 'Mackenzie' alert. I'm sure that was charted when I first started out. Where can I get free DNA testing? My father is alive; & I have a brother.. & descendants. My curiosity has gone wild. Have I accidently traced back to Adam & Eve a couple of times; approx. 15 lines each to Llud Llaw Mawr & Joseph of Arimathea; 3 to MM? I went back to Venus & Pleione of Pleiades & Atlas? Is it so easy to make so many mistakes? I'm not being crass. I really don't know.
In March 1767, the family sailed (on the Earl of Hillsborough, disputed, more likely on the Prince of Wales) from Belfast for Charles Town, South Carolina. As they departed on the ship, Elizabeth was 48 years old and pregnant with her last child, with twelve other children ranging from 2-25 years of age. On May 28, 1767, South Carolina Warrants and Petitions indicate Knox family received 450 acres in a land grant from the General Assembly of South Carolina in Chester County, S.C., 100 miles into the Carolina upcountry. A wagon, head of oxen, plough, seeds and provisions were purchased in Charleston from grant monies. The family moved up the Santee/Catawba Rivers and settled on land close to Fishing Creek in Chester County. The family lived out of wagon until cabin was finished. After the cabin was built, they could enjoy a Saturday night bath in front of the fireplace. They attended the Old Richardson Meeting House on Fishing Creek for Sunday services, also called the Catholic Church, comprised of Covenanters, Associates and Presbyterians, on Rocky Creek. By 1772, the Covenanters had their own church, called Reformed Church, with Reverend William Martin as the minister. He was their minister in Ireland and came over from Ireland bringing the rest of the congregation. Most of the family is mentioned in the Fishing Creek Presbyterian Church visitation list in 1771 – 1774. A Rev. Mr. Lyle preached here on February 19, 1775, using as his text, "Is there no balm in Gilead?" The Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church was organized in 1782. The following year, the forty Associate churches and the twenty Reformed Churches in Virginia, the Carolinas and Georgia were received into this denomination. A Presbytery embracing the churches in the Carolinas and Georgia was organized at Old Long Cane, S.C., February 2, 1790. Elizabeth Knox and James Knox III: Marriage: 1802, SC.///Birth: 21 May 1789 in Ireland D: 25 Feb 1866 in Richburg, Chester County, South Carolina /Burial: 27 Feb 1866 Union Associated Reformed Presbyterian Church Cemetery, Richburg, Chester County, S C This is where it gets interesting.. & confusing. The father of Elizabeth is William Knox, immigrant b. BET 1736 & 176, Lord Bishop of Derry/Co. Derry, Ireland/Drumaull, Ulster, Ireland. 1761? d. BET Oct 31 1830 & May 04 1844, Chester, South Carolina, USA., e. Interrment, Richburg, Chester Co., South Carolina, at Union ARP Cemetery., e. Will, May 1844, m. Patience Gill/ABT 1778, Richburg, Chester County, South Carolinad. Nov 28 1830 [It's a double Knox line] It is solid up to here & continues... William's parents are Lady Elizabeth Craig ["Heritage History of Chester County, South Carolina", 1982, names her Lady Elizabeth Craig. [She was an only child and her estates were confiscated by the Crown. Elizabeth died at the age of 103. She moved from Chester Co., S.C. to Crab Orchard, Kentucky about 1788. Moved from Kentucky to Garrison Fork at Duck River, Bedford Co., Tennessee in the spring of 1812] Her husband; William's father is James KNOX, Sr. was born July 26, 1713 in Glasgow, Lanarkshire and Lady Elizabeth CRAIG was born 1719 in Edinburgh, Scotland. Parents of James KNOX Sr. were John KNOX born 1687 and Agnes JOHNSTONE. Parents of Lady Elizabeth CRAIG were John CRAIG and Elizabeth MOIR/MORE. James and Elizabeth had 12 children. Samuel Knox served as the Sheriff of Tallaoissa County, Alabama before the Civil War. During the war he fought in the Confederate Army and was taken prisioner. When he was released after the war, he moved with his family to Logan County, Arkansas. Samuel is son of Elizabeth Knox the immigrant & James Knox III. Their daughter is Mary Virginia Knox; whose son with Minor Jackson Deason, Edward Adelbert, is my mother's father's father, who married Nancy Arizona Burton. I remember these great~g.parents well; & the house.
Marvin Pilyer Garrett & Heritage History of Chester Co., S.C. Here are some details that may interest you about Elizabeth Craig: Pages 268-270 of "Heritage History of Chester County, South Carolina", 1982, names her Lady Elizabeth Craig. She was an only child and her estates were confiscated by the Irish Crown. Elizabeth died at the age of 103. [1719~1822] She moved from Chester Co., S.C. to Crab ...Orchard, Kentucky about 1788. Moved from Kentucky to Garrison Fork at Duck River, Bedford Co., Tennessee in the spring of 1812.
Happy trails, LuAna Drake
Lady Craig, Planter Lady Elizabeth son Knox, Planter William daughter Knox, Planter Elizabeth son Knox, Samuel daughter Knox, Mary Virginia son Deason, Edward Adelbert son Deason, Sydney Doyle daughter Deason, Barbara Gail daughter Thigpen, Barbara Kim
Craig, Planter Lady Elizabeth son Knox, Planter James, Jr. son Knox, James III son Knox, Samuel daughter Knox, Mary Virginia son Deason, Edward Adelbert son Deason, Sydney Doyle daughter Deason, Barbara Gail daughter Thigpen, Barbara Kim
James KNOX, Sr. was born July 26, 1713 in Glasgow, Lanarkshire and Lady Elizabeth CRAIG was born 1719 in Edinburgh, Scotland.
Parents of James KNOX Sr. were John KNOX born 1687 and Agnes JOHNSTONE. Parents of Lady Elizabeth CRAIG were John CRAIG and Elizabeth MOIR/MORE.
James and Elizabeth KNOX had 12 children. Children born in Scotland: William 1736 m. Patience GILL Mary abt 1739 m. Mr. POLLOCK John 1744 m. Elizabeth EOFF James, Jr. abt 1749 m. Jannet MILLER Elizabeth abt 1751 m. Samuel MORROW
Children born in Ireland: Margaret about 1753 m. Isaac EOFF Samuel 1755 m. Caroline JONES Robert April 11, 1758 m. Elizabeth GILL Joseph 1760 - never married Ann "Nancy" abt 1765 m. Jacob SUTTON Janet 1742 m. John GASTON
Susan born 1767 died 1767 on board ship to America. In 1752 James Knox and his family traveled by ship from Scotland down the River Clyde into the Irish Sea and over to Belfast in Northern Ireland. They sailed from Belfast Harbor in March 1767, aboard the Earl of Hillsborough and landed at Charleston, South Carolina on May 27, 1767. James and Elizabeth Craig Knox and children moved up the Santee/Catawba to present day Chester co SC and settled on land close to Fishing Creek in the NE corner of Chester. Many of their neighbors had come down from NJ, the Suttons, Gastons, Fergusons, Grahams, Craigs, Campbells, Burrises, et al. Elizabeth Knox has come to Bedford and dies there on 1822 at 102 or 103 years old. There was a Knox family on the Donegal, but not James and Elizabeth's.
I see that this group has been quite since 2014. I am looking for a Sarah Delworth 1832 -- married to a John Watt born Ayrshire in 1829. Neither John nor Sarah have death records but both died in Illinois USA.
Geniaus
Quite a few members of GenealogyWise lists including Kirsty and me have joined the "Genealogists for Families" project started up by Judy Webster from Queensland, Australia.
Genealogists worldwide, and their friends and relatives, are working as a team to help small family businesses in low income areas.
Our motto is, 'We care about families (past, present and future)'. Already the Genealogists for Families project has 63 members helping 91 individuals or groups. It would be great if you'd join our team at http://ning.it/say644
More information can be found on the project bloghttp://genfamilies.blogspot.com/
Please consider joining us.
Nov 7, 2011
Geniaus
I've got a Rootstech 2012 Registration to give away - please enter for a chance to win http://geniaus.blogspot.com/2011/11/rootstech-2012-official-blogger...
Nov 9, 2011
Bobby Gerald Hastings
How can we get rid of DUMB ass Post on here
Nov 9, 2011
Kelley V Schulz
Hi, I'm new to this but have been searching my Ancestry for 2 years now. I discovered I have ancestors who immigrated from Scotland and settled in the New England states. Based on my research, this is somewhat uncommon. I believe they most likely immigrated in the 1700's and my 4th Great Grandfather was born in Vermont in the late 1700's. Does anyone have any information on the Montgomery Clan? Supposedly my ancestor who immigrated was the leader of a company of men who left Scotland ater one of the numerous wars with England and settled in the New England State. My 4th Great Grandfather was John Montgomery (b. ABT 1793, Vermont) and his son was Charles Fowler Montgomery (b. 1814, Otego, NY). If anyone has come across this family, any information would be greatly appreciated!
Feb 9, 2012
Tracy Neely
Mar 6, 2012
Judy Anderson
Yes, I can't figure out how to get to that conversation that you just sent me. You have intermediate researcher, so I am sure that you have looked for different spellings of Neely. That is whay happens, even in the same family, or depending on the person that is doing the Census, or even, we found people writing names down on passenger lists, depending on how is it pronounced. Lots of different reasons. But, it is unfortunate your experience with the picture. Have you tried finding that person that has the picture. I love pictures, but that was unfair of that person, especially if they knew who they were. But, on the other hand, you meet lots of lovely people that are willing to share. If there is anything that I can do to help, please let me know. I love helping find the pieces to the puzzle.
Cheers, Judy
Mar 6, 2012
Tracy Neely
Mar 6, 2012
Tracy Neely
Mar 6, 2012
William Douglas
In The Journal of Sir William Brereton of Handforth, Cheshire, wirtten in 1635, it states:
Wee lodged in Glasgoaw in Mr. David Weymes house : his wifes
name is Margrett Cambell (the wives in Scottland never change butt
allwayes retaine their owne names) noe stabling hereunto belonging
I have not seen this reference to married women's names before. How true is this?
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
In Scotland a lot of the times, the women's maiden names were on the heaadstones. Makes it a lot easier for searching .
Mar 7, 2012
Dave Watts
Yes it is true! And they carried the convention all over the English speaking world. Here in Cape Town I se this every time I go off to the Cemetaries to Photographicaly record the headstones for a South African Website. Very practical people my Mothers side. Make excellent Lawyers and Engeneers!
Mar 7, 2012
Tracy Neely
I have read also that when naming children, the oldest son is usually named for the paternal grandfather and the second son is actually the junior. While this is not always the case, if a family is actually doing this, it can give good clues as to where to go for more information.
Mar 7, 2012
Christopher J. Valin
While doing my research I came across this quite a bit, William. For example, all references to Sir Charles Douglas' mother (that I can remember) call her Christian Hepburn rather than Christian Douglas. Some sources I read said that this was the norm in Scotland (at least in the Lowlands) up until about the 17th Century, and that it was done on headstones and in legal documents after that. However, I read one article from 1867 that said that women in Scotland do not retain their maiden names, so the change happened somewhere in between.
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
Yes, and the first female child was usually named after the maternal grandmother. So, when doing research, if there is a child missing, sometimes, it is easy to figure out who is who. But, on the other hand, I have not seen Jr. used. A lot of times, which makes it more confusing, is the child used their middle name to go by. Or a "nickname". Margaret, in my family was "Polly".
The one thing, though, at least in my family, all of the children use that naming pattern. So, imagine, if you go to a family gathering, someone calls out James, and 10 people answer "Yes". Another sad thing, that I have seen many times, in the "older" days, if a child was born illegitimate, that "title" was carried through on their marriage cert. and even on their death cert. Scottish birth, marriage and death cert. are wonderful for records. If a child is born, usually, if the parents are married, it states their marriage date, and also many records have not just the individuals but their parents and their parents occupations and witnesses. So helpful when researching and also many have witnesses, which a lot of times, are siblings or close relatives. I wish the English documents were so detailed.
Mar 7, 2012
Diane Barbour
The usual Scottish naming pattern is this:
1st son Paternal Grandfather
2nd son Maternal Grandfather
3rd son, Father
1st girl Maternal Grandmother
2nd girl Paternal Grandmother
3rd girl Mother
This isn't strictly held to in all families but does occur in many.
Women traditionally did not give up their maiden names in Scotland, This is true in many other European countries, as well..
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
This is true,even to today, a lot of the times, in Quebec, Canada, also.
Yes, that is the list that I have been using for years. Good that you posted it. I was just looking for it myself to post. You are right, it does occur in many still, and very helpful looking for siblings, etc.
Mar 7, 2012
Tracy Neely
I understand what you mean. There are so many Thomases and Johns in my family tree that it is hard to distinguish who belongs to whom. Recently, I think that I found one of my great great grandfather's sisters but instead of going by the name I had seen on the census which was Mary Jane, She was using the name Mollie. Her death certificate said Mollie Neely Daffron. She was in 1910 widowed, running a boarding house and keeping her nephew's children in New Orleans. Do you know if Mollie is a nickname for anything?
Mar 7, 2012
Tracy Neely
I am saying Junior lightly meaning that the second child is usually named after the father.
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
http://usefulenglish.ru/vocabulary/womens-names
This is a great link . My mistake below.
My Gr. Aunt was MARY ANN, and her nickname was POLLY. If you check this site out, and on another page is men's Nicknames, you will see a huge variance. It is very helpful. I think they used nicknames a lot, because of the naming pattern and so many in the family with the same name. I wish they had been more inventive. It is great, when I see the name Barbara, once in a while, so much more helpful, than 10 James, 10 Williams, 10 Margarets etc. etc.
Yes, MOLLIE is one of the nicknames, used for Margaret.
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
More than likely, Jr. was named after his grandfather, like his father before him. My grandmother, which I found interesting, named her children after her sisters, but they in turn had been named by the "Naming Patter" firstly. Interesting and very helpful, though.
Mar 7, 2012
Judy Anderson
Sorry, "Naming Pattern".
Mar 7, 2012
Tracy Neely
Thank you for the site I am going to check it out right now.
Mar 7, 2012
Tracy Neely
I never thought of Mollie being a nickname for Mary.
I also have to consider any Latin naming patterns as John Neelys wife was an Hernandez. And from what I can discern due to the fact that the children of John Neely (Scottish/Irish ancestry) and Frances Hernandez (Latin ancestry , 1880 census says Italy but I think maybe Canary Islands) marry into the creole population in Mobile, Alabama where they are often documented as mulatto. They may have identified more with this side of the family. At least one child moved to St. Bernard Parish where there is a large Canary Island population.
What would have been the educational concerns of a 1st generation American of Scotch-Irish descent of low socioeconomic status for his daughters in the mid to late 1800s? Do you know?
Mar 7, 2012
Rosemary Harris
Most of my 18th & 19th century families follow the Scottish naming pattern. 1st son named for father's father. 2nd son for mother's father and 3rd son for father and 1st daughter for mother's mother, 2nd for father's mother and 3rd for mother. After that sibblings of either parent. This can be very useful for determining which family a person belongs to. Not sure if a woman was actually known by her maiden name or just referred to when spoken about, but headstones always seem to be written that way. Jean Brown, wife of James Stevenson also Elisabeth Stevenson daughter of the above, wife of Robert Orr etc. Most helpful.
Mar 7, 2012
James P. LaLone
Interesting read:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-17740638
Apr 22, 2012
Morag Hughson
Jan 25, 2013
Carolyn Preston
Depending on the age, and thinking sideways and squinting, I'm going with construction training carpenter. Not sure if they existed in 1881 but maybe it will start people thinking.
Jan 25, 2013
Rosemary Harris
On the LDS 1881 disc James Moar 23 if transcribed as Formerly Cond Trung Car and his handicap is imbecile and on Ancestry it is transcribed as Formerly Cond Tram car.. Is it possible that he moved away for work, had a breakdown, hence former occupation, then came home to Mum. I see he was born on Yell which appears bigger than Unst, maybe it had a tramway. Sorry if this appeared before - wasn't sure if I clicked add comment.
Jan 25, 2013
Carolyn Preston
Ohhhh, conductor of a tram car!
Jan 25, 2013
Morag Hughson
Jan 26, 2013
diann marilyn rodger[onclin]
my in-laws were from Glasgow. Robert Rodger-Minnie kirwood Murphy . Have ther birth cert. & marraige cert. Robt. was born 1903 & Minnie 1901.Robt. had 1 brother william imigrated to australia. Have no info on him. also robt,s mother Sarah Sinclair died young & an Aunt Lizzie Duncan took care of family.cannot find correct Murphy info. [Mother,s name was also minnie & father was william it is believed Minnie had 7 brother,s . hughie-john-wm. george-& do not know the other name,s any info would be helpful
Sep 11, 2013
Barbara Kim Thigpen
de Ries, Steward Dapifer Eudo FitzHubert (1047-1080)
* de Ries (de Ryes), Steward Hubert `Humbert` (1020-1086)
* Steward, High Steward Walter of Dundonald (1198-1246)
* Stewart, Alexander 4th (b.1243)
* STEWART, EGIDIA (1327-1406)
* Stewart, High Steward Alexander of Dundonald (1214-1283)
* Stewart, High Steward James (1260-1309)
* Stewart, High Steward Walter (1296...-1327)
* Stewart, Janet (1510-1560)
* Stewart, King James I
* Stewart, King James IV (1473-1513)
* Stewart, Lady Elizabeth
* Stewart, Lady Mary (d.1434)
* Stewart, Mary (1305-1360)
* Stewart, Ms. (b.1412)
* Stewart, Sir James (b.1298)
* Stewart, Sir James 5th (1243-1309)
* Stewart Dundonald, Walter (1180-1246)
* Stewart of Atholl, Earl John (b.1475)
* Stewart of Dundonald, Walter 3rd (1198-1246)
* Stewart, of Scotland, High Steward Walter (1292-1327)
* Stewart, of Scotland, king james II (b.1430)
* Stewart, of Scotland, King James III (d.1488)
* Stewart, of Scotland, Lady Egidia Gille (1332-1406)
# Stuart, King Robert II (1315-1390)
# Stuart, Princess Mary (1380-1458)
# Stuart, `King` Robert III
# Stuart of Lennox, Earl John Keeper of Dumbarton Castle (b.1430)
# Stuart of Lennox, Lady Elizabeth
# Stuart of Lennox, Lord Earl John Keeper of Dumbarton Castle (b.1430)
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
de Warenne/de Varenne, Countess Ada Adeline [mother of 2 Scottish kings]
Gilla Críst of Angus, Mormaer of Angus, son of Gille Brigte of Angus
Crist, Bethóc Beatrix
Marjorie "Princess" of Scotland Born: 1296 at: 23-1,515,866 Died: 2 MAR 1315/1316 at: Paisley,Renfrewshire,Scotland Father:*Robert the Bruce "King" of Scots Mother:*Isabel Mathilda "Lady" of , Mar
*Isabel Mathilda "Lady" of , Mar/ Born: Abt 1278 at: Kildrummy,Aberdeenshire
Robert the Bruce & Bruce, Princess Marjorie
1322 in Rowallan Castle, Kilmarnock, Ayrshire, Elizabeth Muir of Rowallen
Sir Adam Muir & Joan Cunningham Abt 1295 in Fokeltie, Ayrshire
Rowallan Castle is an ancient castle located near Kilmaurs: William Muir & Margaret De Lindsay b 1269 in Craigie Village
Annabella Drummond 1350 George Douglas "Earl" of Angus
Elizabeth Mary Douglas 1385 & Lord Alexander Forbes
James I, II, & III Johnstone
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
mac Dabíd, Earl Prince Eanric Henry of Scotland
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Belach, Endae Naie macBressal
Choluim, Dabíd I mac Maíl I (d.1153)
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Jan 23, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Jan 23, 2014
Carolyn Preston
I'm a little confused, Barbara. Just what are you telling us. Are these your ancestors? What are you basing that on?
Jan 24, 2014
Rosemary Harris
Well said Carolyn. I wondered the same thing. A very impressive list but what does it all mean?
Jan 25, 2014
Jeannette Scott
It is still in common useage that people refer to women by their maiden names & far from being confined to the Lowlands lots of my Highland ancestors were enumerated in the Censuses by their maiden names(particularly after being widowed).
I would say after WW1 until maybe the past twenty years or so that women changed their names but when referred to would be called "Jane Doe" wife of "John Smith" especially if you stayed in the same area you were born /raised in.
Jan 27, 2014
William Douglas
Sue Wemett Although at the time you are researching, Berwick was in England , it was not always so. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berwick-upon-Tweed#Scottish_town
For McConnells in Scotland, try searching for 'McConnells in Kirkcudbrightshire'
Feb 8, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Carolyn, these are my ancestors according to hand~charting using Tribal Pages / The information came from wherever I could find it online. I tend to be thorough. I do have some brick wall ancestors, still. There are more royal Scottish lines in my tree, but I thought I was overwhelming this board, so I added them to my Stories section on my Tribal Tree. Most of my royal lines are older than the Scottish ones. My grand~father sure was proud to be Scottish & spent time in Scotland. I will post pictures. Duh; I don't know how. I can put them on my wall.
Feb 8, 2014
Carolyn Preston
You have documentation going back that far? Wow
Feb 8, 2014
Rosemary Harris
The latest date you mention Barbara is Jean Mary Mackenzie 1628 - 1674 and prior to that the there is one at 1526, then 1256. What about the generations in between and how can you prove that these are all your ancestors. What documentation do you have and what is your link between 2014 and 1628? Are you asking for help in proving this? Any unsourced information has to be questionable.
Feb 9, 2014
William Douglas
Sue Wemett You wrote "I, in fact, can't find any information on any other McConnell is Scotland"
I get 43,700 results for 'McConnells in Kirkcudbrightshire' in my Google search!!!!
Feb 10, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
http://www.scottishroots.com/
Thanks, Rosemary, for the heads up on that 'Mackenzie' alert. I'm sure that was charted when I first started out. Where can I get free DNA testing? My father is alive; & I have a brother.. & descendants. My curiosity has gone wild. Have I accidently traced back to Adam & Eve a couple of times; approx. 15 lines each to Llud Llaw Mawr & Joseph of Arimathea; 3 to MM? I went back to Venus & Pleione of Pleiades & Atlas? Is it so easy to make so many mistakes? I'm not being crass. I really don't know.
Feb 19, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
In March 1767, the family sailed (on the Earl of Hillsborough, disputed, more likely on the Prince of Wales) from Belfast for Charles Town, South Carolina. As they departed on the ship, Elizabeth was 48 years old and pregnant with her last child, with twelve other children ranging from 2-25 years of age.
On May 28, 1767, South Carolina Warrants and Petitions indicate Knox family received 450 acres in a land grant from the General Assembly of South Carolina in Chester County, S.C., 100 miles into the Carolina upcountry. A wagon, head of oxen, plough, seeds and provisions were purchased in Charleston from grant monies. The family moved up the Santee/Catawba Rivers and settled on land close to Fishing Creek in Chester County. The family lived out of wagon until cabin was finished. After the cabin was built, they could enjoy a Saturday night bath in front of the fireplace. They attended the Old Richardson Meeting House on Fishing Creek for Sunday services, also called the Catholic Church, comprised of Covenanters, Associates and Presbyterians, on Rocky Creek. By 1772, the Covenanters had their own church, called Reformed Church, with Reverend William Martin as the minister. He was their minister in Ireland and came over from Ireland bringing the rest of the congregation. Most of the family is mentioned in the Fishing Creek Presbyterian Church visitation list in 1771 – 1774. A Rev. Mr. Lyle preached here on February 19, 1775, using as his text, "Is there no balm in Gilead?" The Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church was organized in 1782. The following year, the forty Associate churches and the twenty Reformed Churches in Virginia, the Carolinas and Georgia were received into this denomination. A Presbytery embracing the churches in the Carolinas and Georgia was organized at Old Long Cane, S.C., February 2, 1790. Elizabeth Knox and James Knox III:
Marriage: 1802, SC.///Birth: 21 May 1789 in Ireland
D: 25 Feb 1866 in Richburg, Chester County, South Carolina /Burial: 27 Feb 1866 Union Associated Reformed Presbyterian Church Cemetery, Richburg, Chester County, S C This is where it gets interesting.. & confusing. The father of Elizabeth is William Knox, immigrant b. BET 1736 & 176, Lord Bishop of Derry/Co. Derry, Ireland/Drumaull, Ulster, Ireland. 1761? d. BET Oct 31 1830 & May 04 1844, Chester, South Carolina, USA., e. Interrment, Richburg, Chester Co., South Carolina, at Union ARP Cemetery., e. Will, May 1844, m. Patience Gill/ABT 1778, Richburg, Chester County, South Carolinad. Nov 28 1830 [It's a double Knox line] It is solid up to here & continues... William's parents are Lady Elizabeth Craig ["Heritage History of Chester County, South Carolina", 1982, names her Lady Elizabeth Craig. [She was an only child and her estates were confiscated by the Crown. Elizabeth died at the age of 103. She moved from Chester Co., S.C. to Crab Orchard, Kentucky about 1788. Moved from Kentucky to Garrison Fork at Duck River, Bedford Co., Tennessee in the spring of 1812] Her husband; William's father is James KNOX, Sr. was born July 26, 1713 in Glasgow, Lanarkshire and Lady Elizabeth CRAIG was born 1719 in Edinburgh, Scotland. Parents of James KNOX Sr. were John KNOX born 1687 and Agnes JOHNSTONE. Parents of Lady Elizabeth CRAIG were John CRAIG and Elizabeth MOIR/MORE. James and Elizabeth had 12 children. Samuel Knox served as the Sheriff of Tallaoissa County, Alabama before the Civil War. During the war he fought in the Confederate Army and was taken prisioner. When he was released after the war, he moved with his family to Logan County, Arkansas. Samuel is son of Elizabeth Knox the immigrant & James Knox III. Their daughter is Mary Virginia Knox; whose son with Minor Jackson Deason, Edward Adelbert, is my mother's father's father, who married Nancy Arizona Burton. I remember these great~g.parents well; & the house.
Feb 21, 2014
Barbara Kim Thigpen
Marvin Pilyer Garrett & Heritage History of Chester Co., S.C.
Here are some details that may interest you about Elizabeth Craig: Pages 268-270 of "Heritage History of Chester County, South Carolina", 1982, names her Lady Elizabeth Craig. She was an only child and her estates were confiscated by the Irish Crown. Elizabeth died at the age of 103. [1719~1822] She moved from Chester Co., S.C. to Crab ...Orchard, Kentucky about 1788. Moved from Kentucky to Garrison Fork at Duck River, Bedford Co., Tennessee in the spring of 1812.
Happy trails,
LuAna Drake
Lady Craig, Planter Lady Elizabeth son Knox, Planter William daughter Knox, Planter Elizabeth son Knox, Samuel daughter Knox, Mary Virginia son Deason, Edward Adelbert son Deason, Sydney Doyle daughter Deason, Barbara Gail daughter Thigpen, Barbara Kim
Craig, Planter Lady Elizabeth son Knox, Planter James, Jr. son Knox, James III son Knox, Samuel daughter Knox, Mary Virginia son Deason, Edward Adelbert son Deason, Sydney Doyle daughter Deason, Barbara Gail daughter Thigpen, Barbara Kim
James KNOX, Sr. was born July 26, 1713 in Glasgow, Lanarkshire and Lady Elizabeth CRAIG was born 1719 in Edinburgh, Scotland.
Parents of James KNOX Sr. were John KNOX born 1687 and Agnes JOHNSTONE. Parents of Lady Elizabeth CRAIG were John CRAIG and Elizabeth MOIR/MORE.
James and Elizabeth KNOX had 12 children.
Children born in Scotland:
William 1736 m. Patience GILL
Mary abt 1739 m. Mr. POLLOCK
John 1744 m. Elizabeth EOFF
James, Jr. abt 1749 m. Jannet MILLER
Elizabeth abt 1751 m. Samuel MORROW
Children born in Ireland:
Margaret about 1753 m. Isaac EOFF
Samuel 1755 m. Caroline JONES
Robert April 11, 1758 m. Elizabeth GILL
Joseph 1760 - never married
Ann "Nancy" abt 1765 m. Jacob SUTTON
Janet 1742 m. John GASTON
Susan born 1767 died 1767 on board ship to America.
In 1752 James Knox and his family traveled by ship from Scotland down the River Clyde into the Irish Sea and over to Belfast in Northern Ireland. They sailed from Belfast Harbor in March 1767, aboard the Earl of Hillsborough and landed at Charleston, South Carolina on May 27, 1767. James and Elizabeth Craig Knox and children moved up the Santee/Catawba to present day Chester co SC and settled on land close to Fishing Creek in the NE corner of Chester. Many of their neighbors had come down from NJ, the Suttons, Gastons, Fergusons, Grahams, Craigs, Campbells, Burrises, et al. Elizabeth Knox has come to Bedford and dies there on 1822 at 102 or 103 years old. There was a Knox family on the Donegal, but not James and Elizabeth's.
Apr 2, 2014
Earl Watt
I see that this group has been quite since 2014. I am looking for a Sarah Delworth 1832 -- married to a John Watt born Ayrshire in 1829. Neither John nor Sarah have death records but both died in Illinois USA.
Jun 24, 2016