Haplogroup R1a1a

Comment

Comment by Jacqueline Ryerson on July 16, 2011 at 11:49am

So far my brother's dna is neg for L342. I have upgraded to 111 markers but no matches so far at 37, 67 or 111. Possibly match (genetic distance of 4) at 67 but he is waiting for the rest of the markers to come thru. Y-search id is DR7BR. Where should I look further. It appears that the possibly match (distance of 4) has a surname of Schanz.

Comment by Robert Sliwinski on July 9, 2011 at 7:02am

Hi Laurie, thanks for posting.  How many markers did you have tested and did you post the results on Ysearch.org? (the public database managed by FTDNA)  I can take a look at the results if you'd like.  Currently, R1a1a is being refined even further to R1a1a1.  However you would need to have some SNP tests run (to reveal single mutations on the DNA that define subgroups.

Comment by Robert Sliwinski on March 10, 2011 at 8:53pm

Jacqueline,

Thanks for posting.  Yes the R1a haplotree is changing.  Your brother's R1a1a has several possibilities with SNP tests.  M458+ can lead to several possibilities with several  additional SNP tests that are associated with additional subgroups. There are haplotypes that have an association with several SNPs that have been deduced from 67 marker results.  The Polish Project at FTDNA has sub types listed in categories with with the Y-DNA results.  You could compare your brothers results to those and see if you have any close matches to figure out if you are associated with any subtype.

Comment by Jacqueline Ryerson on March 10, 2011 at 5:21pm

I just checked with FTDNA & found that my brothers haplogroup was changed from R1a1 to R1a1a & it looks like others had their haplogroups changed also. It looks like down the line a M458 test will need to be done but I will need to check the price & if its worth it in the long run.

Comment by Robert Sliwinski on May 9, 2010 at 2:18pm

Curt,

Order the M458 test from FTDNA. Being positive for this marker ties you closely with the Polish origins, however coming out negative just means that you are still Polish or at least Slavic, but there is a chance your ancestry may have migrated from some where else over 2000 years ago. Nonetheless if you go far back enough, the people in Poland migrated from somewhere, mainly from West central asia and southeastern Europe, for those who are R1a1a. Thanks for joining this group.

Regarding your other question I am 458 - which makes sense since I have the distant connection with India. However the origin for my ancestry about 3000 years ago is from west central asia. My relation ship with the guy from India was based on 67 markers with a genetic distance of 14 (which is the number of marker values were are different). I have no closer matches on Ysearch.org.
However my more recent ancestors have been in Poland for a long time. I still have relatives there.

I also speak Polish and if I can locate my book Polish Surnames by Hoffman I be able to see if it pertains to "oak".
The 67 marker test does not include the M458 test. Also if you have not already please join the FTDNA Polish project.

Comment by Curtis Michael Dombek on May 9, 2010 at 1:32pm

I learned today that I am R1a1a. I am a lawyer in Los Angeles. My paternal grandfather, Michael (or Michel) Dombek was apparently from Potok, which is a village near Zamosc in what is now far southeastern Poland. His father's name was Pavel Dombek. Michael spoke Polish, but his naturalization papers indicated that he had Russian citizenship at that time. A Polish scholar once told me that the spelling "Dombek" is a Czech spelling of the name (that in Polish it would be Dabek with the circumflex under the "a" indicating the nasal version of the vowel). I would be interested in getting the M458 test to see if that provides stronger confirmation of his Polish ethnicity since this other evidence in the family is a bit ambiguous. Who does that test? Do you know if the 67 marker test at Family Tree DNA includes M458? Is that how you learned of your 14 marker match in India? They already have my sample. Thanks for any advice you can provide.
Curt Dombek

Comment by Robert Sliwinski on November 22, 2009 at 10:30am

The Fall issue of the Journal of Genetic Genealogy just came out and contains an article by Peter Gwozdz pertaining to STR analysis of R1a haplotypes to determine potential subgroup or subclades. This is quite the comprehensive analysis.

Y-STR Mountains in Haplospace, Part II: Application to
Common Polish Clades can be viewed at
http://www.jogg.info/52/files/Gwozdz2.pdf

Comment by Robert Sliwinski on November 17, 2009 at 12:21pm

Just recently a paper by Underhill et. al 2009 entitled "Separating the post Glacial coancestry of European and Asian Y-chromosomes within haplogroup R1a" was published in the European Journal of Human Genetics.

Wikipedia has also been updated on R1a as well based on this new information on new subclades of R1a.

Based on Underhill et. al (2009)R1a1 is now R1a1a. The main two subclades are R1a1a* and R1a1a7. R1a1a7 is positive for M458 an SNP that separate it from the rest of R1a1a. It is significant because M458 is a European marker and the epicenter is Poland. I've ordered the M458 test to see if I am positive or not. I encourage those R1a1's out there to see if you have that marker since it may provide a better idea of geographic origin than before (through FTDNA). The paper also pointed out that R1a1a influence into India was not from Europe since the M458 marker is rare in India.

Robert

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